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1.6 Hdi Engines And Mileage


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#1 GeoffT

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Posted 20 August 2011 - 11:29 AM

i'm thinking of downgrading my faithful 10 year old 2 ltr HDi (87000 miles) to runabout status for the wife and perhaps buying a Berlingo which would be better suited to our occasional camping trips. I have great faith in the 2 litre engine but don't trust the later 1.6 version, having read a few tales of woe about them. I've seen a Berlingo with the spec I like on an 09 plate with 29000 miles on the clock. Should I be looking for lower mielage or should this be reliable for another 50-60,000 miles? I am assuming the 90 bhp engine in the Berlingo is the same one as the Xpic has?

#2 cris1117

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Posted 20 August 2011 - 07:44 PM

Hi.
I do a lot of miles 70,000 plus a year I tend to think any diesel is good for at least 200,000 miles providing it gets regular oil changes.

My last car had the jtd engine and covered 220,000 with no engine faults, and as far as I know is still going strong.

I drove the Berlingo and didn’t find it a nice drive and heavy on fuel, so you may want to check out the consumption figures.

I currently have a 1.6hdi 110bhp and love it, it’s great on fuel 60+mpg, with the mileage I do that’s very important.

The mere fact that these forums are mostly visited by people with problem cars can put you off a certain model but the vast majority of owners have no problems.

I think you could pick any make and model car and go to the relative forum and read tales of woe, so I wouldn’t let that influence you too much.

#3 stimulator

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Posted 21 August 2011 - 09:17 AM

I have the 1.6HDi engine in a C3 SX 07 reg. It's a great engine and after having had a 1.4HDi C3 SX 54 reg, it like chalk and cheese. The 2.0HDi Pic we had was good but these are much better. The shear joy of driving with this lump under your foot is wonderful. The car is only 4 years old and just done 24K, but has had no problems and uses no oil between changes. Returns average of 55mpg in town and 63mpg on open road. Love it.
62 Reg C3 Picasso VTR+ 1.6 HDi 92BHP
Previous Xsara Picasso 20HDi, C3 SX 1.4HDi, C3 SX 1.6HDI, C4 Picasso 1.6HDi VTR+ EGS

#4 GeoffT

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Posted 21 August 2011 - 10:14 AM

I do a lot of miles 70,000 plus a year I tend to think any diesel is good for at least 200,000 miles providing it gets regular oil changes.

Many thanks - that's very encouraging. I certainly feel that my own Pic's engine would go on for at least a couple of hundred thousand miles especially considering I used to change the oil every 6,000 miles when i was using it more, but I do wonder about things like turbos and fuel pumps which could cost as much as the car is worth to fix plus maybe some age-related problems. Seems, though that my fears about the later engines are unfounded.

I was interested in your comments on the Berlingo. I recently test drove a Peugeot Partner Tepee (same car) and found it much nicer to drive than the Pic but this may only apply to the post 2008 models based on the C4/308 platform. I was talking to a lady who owned one a couple of days later and she reckoned she got 57 to the gallon on a run fully loaded with gear, dogs and two grown up children. Although we are OAPs, my wife and I have returned to tent camping after a using trailer tent for 13 years. We don't rough it so its a 4 berth tent plus camping fridge, loo, tables & chairs, kitchen stuff, gas bottled etc. etc. If we take the rear seats out of the Pic, we can pack it in fairly comfortably without piling it up to the roof. If we leave the seats in and fold them forward it's more of a struggle. Neither the C4 Pic nor C4 Grand Pic can match the Xsara version for space. A Berlingo would make things much easier especially if we wanted to tour more - we could just bung the stuff in rather than pack it.

#5 pixan

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Posted 21 August 2011 - 10:32 AM

GeoffT, I can confirm what cris1117 says. I have two 110s with DPFS (FAP) and I love them both. Regular 59 mpg with 60+ on long runs. My previous 2.0L Xantia did over 137K miles and never had any problems. A friend of mine accross the road has a 53 plate Berlingo but isn't happy with the ride. He thinks it's because they are van based models. He hasn't had any problems either and has done over 80k miles on his Berlingo.

Go for the 110 every time. You'll really enjoy it. Don't be put off by the loud mouths on this forum constantly bleating about Citroen Picasso problems. Next time you go out, just notice how many Picassos there are on the roads today. That should give you comfort. As has already been pointed out, there isn't a car on the road that doesn't have it's own set of problems. A short while ago it was dual mass flywheels, then the (FAP)DPFS filter, God knows what'll be next from the Citroen knockers on this forum. The CitPic is very hard to beat.

However, if you are getting a Xpic 110, you must use Citroen's recommended oil which is Quartz INEO ECS 5W30 all year round. This is the ONLY oil that compliments the E4 diesel engines, looks after the turbo, and avoids build up in the EGR valve.

Edited by JoeBlunt, 22 August 2011 - 07:26 AM.


#6 GeoffT

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Posted 21 August 2011 - 12:17 PM

Thanks for that, Pixan. I was hoping to get something that's 1-3 years old so if I decided to get another Xpic, I would be confined to the Desire which I think was only 90 bhp in latter years. There's no rush for this but all the info helps to crystalise my thoughts. No doubt soon I shall have a rush of blood to the head!

Edited by JoeBlunt, 22 August 2011 - 07:27 AM.
Quote Removed - No need to quote previous post if you are replying immediately afterwards.


#7 cris1117

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Posted 21 August 2011 - 05:42 PM

Hi.
The belingo I drove was a 05 I think and as previously said was very much like driving a van, perhaps they have improved things on newer models.

I found the driving position uncomfortable on long trips and the handling very poor considering it had such hard suspension (very van like).

As I said I love the pic for its comfort and find the cruise control a great asset on long runs.

#8 blondchaser

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Posted 21 August 2011 - 08:47 PM

There are a few 2008 110's around. Just a couple of months ago there were some very low milage 110's on the market.
If you do go for the 92bhp version you can get the VTX model which has cruise control, reverse bleeper and those confounded alloy wheels.
If you are a high motorway miler then the 110 is perhaps best (high geared) IF you can get a good un. If car is just for normal work / family duties the 92bhp is a worthwhile consideration. I certainly get much more mpg from my 92 than i could get from my last 110.

#9 GeoffT

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Posted 22 August 2011 - 09:55 AM

Hi.
The belingo I drove was a 05 I think and as previously said was very much like driving a van, perhaps they have improved things on newer models.

I found the driving position uncomfortable on long trips and the handling very poor considering it had such hard suspension (very van like).

As I said I love the pic for its comfort and find the cruise control a great asset on long runs.


I've heard this said of the old Berlingo before but I gather the latest version is a whole new ball game. I've read a couple of reviews of it and this seems to be the general opinion. One of them reckoned it was as good as any hatch in terms of handling and comfort. I still need to convince myself that I can drive around in a vehicle like that all year round for the sake of one or two camping trips in the Summer but another test drive might convince me. It'll be a close call between the two cars but I do think the Berlingo is a much more modern car being based on the C4/308 floorpan as opposed to the old ZX floorpan. I think I'm going back to my Renault 4 days in my old age!

Thanks too, Stimulator and Blondchaser, for your info. It's all grist to the mill.

GeoffT

#10 pilot

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Posted 22 August 2011 - 01:22 PM

Had a 2005 1.6HDi Pic Exclusive for 3 years and have now got a Peugeot with the same 110bhp HDi engine.They have both had some unusual low speed characteristics due I feel to the computer control (anti stall etc) but in general they have provided excellent,powerful,for their size, and very reliable motoring.Trouble free for all my ownership time.I am sure that not everyone's experience will be the same but there are now literally millions of them about so a few negative experiences are to be expected. Hope you have a trouble free car.

Edited by pilot, 22 August 2011 - 01:23 PM.

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#11 Barrowboybill

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Posted 13 September 2011 - 04:59 PM

As 2 picasso household I find my Partners 1.6 hdi very nippy and she manages to get about 60mpg, where as my old 2.0 hdi is a bit more sluggish and returns about 44mpg, that said we have been very happy with them, nothing catastrophic with the cars or engines apart from usual maintenance and both are cars are upto 130K mileage wise, would like to change them but can't find anything we like as much...unless we can find some newer xsara pics.

Cheers
Alex
Bye Bye Xsara Picasso's......Hello 2 off 1600hdi EGS so its VTR+ for me and Exclusive for her ladyship.

#12 GeoffT

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Posted 13 September 2011 - 05:48 PM

Thanks for that, Alex - very reassuring. I haven't taken the plunge yet but it so happens that I'm going to look at a Berlingo tomorrow and may cave in. Like you, we haven't found anything else that we like as much as the Pic but the Berlingo will be just that bit more practical for our needs and is surprisingly nice to drive. Like the Pic, they have their fans but it's certainly no status symbol. We'll definitely keep the Pic as well all the time we need two cars and it'll be goodbye to my wife's 17 year old Clio.

Cheers

Geoff

Edited by mcdig, 13 September 2011 - 09:15 PM.
No need to quote previous post when replying.


#13 rodh

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Posted 13 September 2011 - 08:03 PM

Hi, yes a difficult choice. There's not much to beat the pic without paying lots of money. We have just come back from France and they are everywhere! Plenty of the C4 pics too. Look what Honest John site has to say.

I ran the Peugeot Partner van for two years, an 05 model and my wife and I found it very comfortable, the seat support was excellent but it was a van. We stuck our camping stuff in the side loading door and a bike too. Great. That one had the uprated 1886cc diesel. I liked it but the emmisions were high and the road tax went up. Not an HDI of course.

I am coming to the point that the Berlingo and Peugeot badged one are great little vehicles in terms of practicality and the new Tepee and Berlingo based on the C4 must be excellent to drive and still have that practicality. I think the new C3 Picasso may also be a real alternative for you. Sort of a little mpv yet van at the same time. The newer stuff have all the creature comforts too, you are spoiled for choice!

#14 GeoffT

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Posted 13 September 2011 - 08:51 PM

The advantage of the Xpic is that you can take the rear seats out which you can't on the later ones or the C3 Pic. This is what we do when my wife and I go off camping; I have tried it with the seats in and it's more of a struggle (we don't rough it when we go - 4 birth tent, fridge, loo, kitchen, tables & chairs etc) and with a Beringo there's even more space even with the seats in. The new one, based on the C4 is slightly larger than the older version and wider than the Xpic. It was the Partner version that I test drove and found it very car-like in its handling. Much better than the original, I gather. It's certainly a more modern vehicle.

Edited by mcdig, 13 September 2011 - 09:16 PM.
No need to quote previous post when replying.


#15 Barrowboybill

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Posted 19 October 2011 - 08:49 AM

Well the Suspension has gone on my old Xsara Pic, so I have taken the plunge and ordered us 2 used C4 Pics both 1.6 hdi powered, first one arrived this week and wow, what a car I loved our old pics, but this one with the semi auto box is just so nice to drive...bit wider and longer than the old pic to me, but suppose you get used to it.

So did you get some new wheels Geoff?

Alex
Bye Bye Xsara Picasso's......Hello 2 off 1600hdi EGS so its VTR+ for me and Exclusive for her ladyship.

#16 GeoffT

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Posted 19 October 2011 - 11:22 AM

Well the Suspension has gone on my old Xsara Pic, so I have taken the plunge and ordered us 2 used C4 Pics both 1.6 hdi powered, first one arrived this week and wow, what a car I loved our old pics, but this one with the semi auto box is just so nice to drive...bit wider and longer than the old pic to me, but suppose you get used to it.

So did you get some new wheels Geoff?

Alex

Congratulations on the new cars, Alex. I quite fancied the C4 Picasso; it just seemed generally nicer or maybe less basic in utilitarian terms. In the end, I decided against it because it didn't have the load capacity I was after that you can get in the Xpic by taking the seats out. So, I stuck with my original plan and bought an '09 Berlingo XTR and it really is nice to drive - you certainly don't notice you've got that great big lump stuck on the back and it's so versatile. With Berlingos, you need to have the XTR (top model) just to get a similar specification to the Xpic. We have kept the Picasso which is now my wife's car and I still like to get back into it and drive it even though it now feels a bit dated in comparison. No offence to Xpic owners - I still love it!
Interesting that you mention the C4 Pic being larger. This was one of my concerns about the Berlingo which I guess must be about the same size as it uses the same floorpan but I haven't noticed any difference driving it. As for the original point, I do like the 1.6Hdi engine -mine's the 90 bhp version. I doubt whether it has better torque but maybe my car is slightly lower geared for I can easily stay in 4th gear in a 30 mph limit and pull away when the limit increases.

Geoff

#17 chrisg

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Posted 23 October 2011 - 01:42 AM

hi! im just new to this and im not sure how to start a topic but i have a question regarding the gear box oil location on a 2001 2.0 hdi xsara picasso im looking to change it and i dont no where to fill it and drain it if someone got back to me that would be great cheers

#18 GeoffT

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Posted 23 October 2011 - 11:05 AM

I've never changed the gearbox oil myself so can't help you there I'm afraid. Mine has only ever been topped up if required when serviced so as far as I know it's still running with the original oil.

For future reference, to start a new topic, you'll find a button marked 'Start a new topic' (would you believe) both at the top and at the bottom of the page you are looking at now. Just click on that and enter a suitable topic heading and away you go.

#19 rawthey

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Posted 23 October 2011 - 01:12 PM

IFor future reference, to start a new topic, you'll find a button marked 'Start a new topic' (would you believe) both at the top and at the bottom of the page you are looking at now. Just click on that and enter a suitable topic heading and away you go.

But he's a new member so that button won't appear until after he's made 5 posts and the only way he can do that is by replying to existing topics.
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#20 GeoffT

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Posted 23 October 2011 - 03:04 PM

Ah. You live and learn. I've only been on the site a few weeks myself. Sorry to mislead.